Carrie: It must have looked nice with blood on it.
Madonna What happened was that we got into the car to go to church and I was disgusted that I had to wear this lime green dress with white stripes on it. I had on white ankle socks with white shoes. I thought I looked hideous. I got into the front seat of the station wagon next to my stepmother. The car was completelly filled up with all my brothers and sisters. I mumbled something about this horrible ugly dress I was wearing, and my stepmother just went BAM! I always got nosebleeds when I was little and my nose bled very easily. Even though I was in agony, I couldn’t have been more thrilled. Not only did I not have to wear that dress, but I didn’t have to go to church. My nose wouldn’t stop bleeding, so everyone left and I got to stay home.
Carrie: So you were supposed to be a good little girl. Were you supposed to be a vigin when you got married?
Madonna Yes, and my stepmother told me I wasn’t allowed to wear tampons until I got married. Can you imagine? What’s why my friend Moira had to teach me how to wear a tampon. I’m telling you, I put it in sideways and was walking around paralyzed one day. It pinched a nerve or something.
Carrie: And you were rebelling by putting it in at all.
Madonna Yes, but I wanted to go swimming. It was during the summer, and who can go swimming with a Kotex on?
Carrie: Probably someone.
Madonna Probably Mormons or something. No, you just don’t go swimming – just like you don’t fuck when you’re Catholic if you don’t want to get pregnant. There are all these stupid rules.
Carrie: My favorite Polish joke is the one where all the Polish people have fifty dollars and they go to New York. They’re sent out to find something to do. One of them goes out and comes back later with a carton of Tampax. They go, “What is this?” He says: “Look! You can go swimming, you can go horseback riding, you can go sky diving.”
Madonna That’s cute.
Carrie: When did you lose your virginity?
Madonna When I was fourteen.
Carrie: So you got into rebelling.
Madonna Right away.
Carrie: Did they know?
Madonna Nooo. Oh, no.
Carrie: And when they did find out that you had?
Madonna They didn’t.
Carrie: They’ll find out through this article.
Madonna I’ve never really talked about sex with my father. My parents were virgins when they got married. My mother was very religious, too. I think my father realized I was having sex once I married Sean [Penn]. Before then I don’t think he did. I never brought any guys around because my parents lived in Michigan and I lived in New York at the time.
Carrie: When did you move away from home?
Madonna When I was seventeen. But I never brought anybody home. Oh, once I brought Jellybean [Benitez] home, but we had to sleep in separate bedrooms.
Carrie: Did you sneak?
Madonna No, because my father’s bedroom was in between.
Carrie: In “Truth Or Dare” when your father came to the show, was that the first time he had seen you simulate masturbation and be so explicit about everything?
Madonna I don’t know if he’s seen all the other things I’ve done. I’m sure when the nude pictures in Playboy and the album Like A Virgin came out he went through a period of extreme shock.
Carrie: Did he ever say anything?
Carrie: That’s nice – I guess.
Madonna I’m not sure. I haven’t decided. When I go home, my father absolutely does not acknowledge that I’m famous, or a star, or a celebrity, or that I’ve made it in any way. He doesn’t talk about it so I can fit in and not feel scorn of my brothers and sisters. I’m not sure that I like that.
Carrie: That must be complicated if you go out to dinner.
Madonna I never go out to dinner when I go home.
Carrie: So you don’t want to make him confront your celebrity.
Madonna No, I would like it if he talked about it, actually, but he never does. Maybe I want him to recognize it so that finally I’ll have his approval.
Carrie: To not have his disapproval –
Madonna Is better than nothing.
Carrie: But it would be nice to have a conversation with him about what you do. You would probably have to assume that – given your upbringing – he would object to it.
Madonna My father’s not inceribly confrontial about things like that.
Carrie: He gave you loud advice. He gave you orders.
Madonna My father has had a lot of tragedies in his life. I have some very crazy brothers who really keep my father busy.
Carrie: So you’re a success story, despite the fact that some of what you do flies in the face of his religion.
Carrie: At least you’re not in rehab.
Madonna I’m not in rehab, and he’s not still supporting me.
Carrie: Is he still supporting them?
Madonna Well, if they could spend a couple of months out of rehab they could get jobs.
Carrie: How many of them are doing that?
Madonna There are two of them that sort of go in and out. They have problems. One’s just an older version of the other.
Carrie: And one of them was in “Truth Or Dare”.
Carrie: Do you get along with him?
Madonna Yeah, I do.
Carrie: Has he seen the movie?
Madonna No, he hasn’t. I know he’s looking forward to it because he really wants to be a star in his own right.
Carrie: A star at what?
Madonna Anything. He’s a real con artist. He’s got this great deep voice, so for a while he was a disc jockey for black radio stations. He thinks he’s a black person, I think. He’s histerically funny.